Goku Is Not A Good Father (aka The Official DBS Liveblogging Thread)

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

[Apollo the Just]

krillin's eyeballs are made of skin. his pupils are just giant moles protruding from his skin eyes. krillin is terrifying.

[Deepfake]

It's even stranger because in the manga he has normal eyes but still no nose, and some of the game models are based on that...

[Apollo the Just]

for some reason, krillin with white eyes is even weirder than just krillin with flesh eyes. because the white eyes make his lack of nose more pronounced somehow.

KRILLIN WHAT ARE YOU

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

Marron inherited his lack of nose as a child but grew one as a teen (in GT). I wonder how Super will handle that.

What a weird family. Monster Krillin dad, Android mom...guess a kid that can't decide if it has a nose or not is pretty normal, all things considered.

[Apiary Tazy]

The fact that Krillin doesn't have a nose was used in his favor. He defeated someone who's main ability was being the stinkiest fighter to ever exist because he remembered he has no nose.

*shrug*

[Valigarmander]

Theory: Krillin isn't a short human being, but a giant, pink-skinned member of Pilaf's species.

[Apollo the Just]

You guys I'm basically going to explode, I have a lot of opinions about DBS -- 80% positive, 20% negative -- buT

[spoiler=DBS next episode]MY BB!!!!! MY SON!! MY HUSBAND!!!!!! MY ONE MY ONLY MY EVERYTHING IS COMING B A C K T H I S S U N D A YYYYYY and I can't Deal?

I LOVE a lot of things about Super. I love the way characters are treated, especially in contrast to everyone except Vegeta at the end of the Buu arc where Toriyama just clearly didn't give a ****. There has been a lot of really good development, especially with my OTHER son / huband / one / only / everything Gohan, and I am So Happy. He's spending time with his real dad Piccolo and his wife/best friend Videl and his BUNDLE OF JOY PAN. But like.

I'm not a fan of how after multiverse theory was introduced using time travel in DBZ, Super is like THERE ARE MULTIPLE UNIVERSES!!!!!!!!! But they're all temporally linear and Whis can go back in time but without splitting timelines. Like, on one hand I'm down with the multiple universes because it makes for cool AUs like with Frost and Sadal (lmao planet salad), but ALSO WHY IS TIME BEING TREATED SO BORING COMPARED TO IN Z? COME ON YOU HAVE LITERAL GODS HERE AND THEY CAN MANIPULATE AND LOOK BACK IN TIME BUT SOMEHOW EVERYTHING IS STILL LINEAR AND YOU CAN'T VIEW MULTIPLE TIMELINES OF AN EXISTING PLANET. Idk man like they're bringing back my Future Husband so hopefully they'll bring back with it a cool and interesting treatment of time in storytelling but IDK I AM APPREHENSIVE

also apprehensive because i s2g if they ship trunks and mai im throwing myself in a garbage can. she is like 35 years older than he is I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THEIR PHYSICAL APPEARANCE THAT IS GROSS AND PEDOPHILIC

CAN THEY PLEASE JUST BE ASSKICKING PLATONIC TIME TRAVEL BUDDIES????? PLEASE?????????????

anyway im very nervous because Trunks was a HUGE part of the COOLEST AND MOST INTERESTING arc in Z and i just. i want this arc to live up to it. and it probably will but im just nervous because i lov e hi m BUT IM ALSO SO EXCITED AND IM JUST. IM GONNA BARF[/spoiler]

i have a lot of feelings always

[Valigarmander]

I'll bet Super Trunks won't be as cool as GT Trunks.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

[spoiler]I think the timeline things are going to get some more explanation since Jaco is Time Patrol, and now Future Trunks is coming. It's been about universes more than timelines so far but I feel that will change soon.

Also I don't care how they go about the Trunks/Mai thing. I just think it is interesting that she is getting more spotlight now.[/spoiler]

Rumors are that Demigra from XV will be involved. Not sure how I feel about that. It is neat, opens a lot of doors, but we'll see.

[Apollo the Just]

[spoiler]I think you're probably right on the time stuff, I'm just nervous and apprehensive because I WANT THIS TO BE REALLY REALLY REALLY GOOD..............

I'm excited for Mai getting more spotlight, I like her a lot and I'm down with oldschool DBZ villains coming back. I'm just really holding out hope that they aren't just developing a female character to give Future Trunks a love interest. Who is 40 years older than him. SOMEONE OLDER THAN GOKU SHOULD NOT BE GETTING WITH VEGETA AND BULMA'S SON. No thank you.

PLEASE JUST BE PLATONIC SPACETIME BUTT KICKING BUDDIES I AM HERE FOR THAT ****[/spoiler]

^ if that rumor is true, it will be interesting to see what elements from XV are canonized and what aren't.

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

[spoiler]Well, realistically Mai is weak. In DBZverse if you're weak you're generally just a plot device. So she seems like love interest material to me, lol. Also, she seems like she is still young for some reason. Maybe it's the grown-up version of Kid Mai from Super? But I don't know how that would happen since there are no Dragon Balls in Future Trunk's timeline for Mai to make a wish to be young in the first place. Maybe they just said "**** it, waifu for trunksu, shes young now." I hope not haha.[/spoiler]

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

So, DBZ trivia. It's literally canon that Goku isn't a good father:

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... d-message/

The main character Goku is a strong, pure, good person, but he’s also a battle-obsessed, hopeless case of a human being, who has some issues as a father. Yet for some reason, he possesses a mysterious, lighthearted charm that keeps his circle of friends growing and growing.

For some reason I just thought that it was an accident that he came off as a bad dad, but apparently it was intentional, lol.

EDIT: This probably has something to do with it:

Goku might not have a sense of family members like Gohan and Chi-Chi except as one of his companions.

I find this kind of stuff endlessly interesting.

[Apollo the Just]

I'm so relieved to see that it was intentional, because from the very beginning it was clear to me that Goku had 0 empathy for the fact that his son works differently than he does. There was already a focus on Gohan being upset at Goku's dismissal and yelling in the Frieza arc, and in the Cell arc Piccolo drags Goku to hell and back for treating Gohan the way he did, and at parts of the Buu arc there are callbacks to the Cell fight that highlight that pain, and in Super we see Gohan making a point of being the kind of person he had so clearly needed when he was growing up. It's been a recurring thing, and I'm glad that the creator even recognizes that the main character of this franchise is flawed in this way, and Gohan's development ((save parts of Buu)) also reflect this.

NGL tho it's easy to be confused as to whether it's intentional or not since Goku never really has to address his mistakes in the story. In the end it's written like ~everything worked out okay so it's fine~.. I think what I wanted more than anything was a How to Train Your Dragon moment - buff dad eventually approves of nerd son's ways and they reconcile their differences and learn from one another. But instead Gohan got Piccolo as replacement dad so that's okay too

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

I think "everything worked out okay so it's fine" pretty much sums up Goku's carefree personality pretty well. I think if it went any other way it would kind of contradict his integrity as that type of character, for better or worse.

Also, omg, I can't wait for this new Future Trunks Arc of DBS to start.

[MEDIA=youtube]q_bvjxXdhIQ[/MEDIA]

plz hurry

[Apollo the Just]

i have been a nervous wreck since the first future trunks footage was released....... I NEED IT............ SPEAKIN OF NERD SONS AND THEIR BUFF DADS.................

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

Oh man, me too. Thinking back, I remember an interview with Toriyama saying he was saving a Super Saiyan White form for later. Black coming up, I think he gave away the next form. I'm glad because blue just doesn't really look as cool as the past forms nor as good as white will, I think.

[Valigarmander]

Future!Mai looks awfully young, considering she's older than Bulma. Or did she get turned into a child in that timeline too? And if so... how? Piccolo was killed by the androids shortly after Trunks was born, so there are no Dragon Balls in that world to wish on.[DOUBLEPOST=1465593871,1465593805][/DOUBLEPOST][QUOTE="I REALLY HATE POKEMON!, post: 1598415, member: 18119"]Oh man, me too. Thinking back, I remember an interview with Toriyama saying he was saving a Super Saiyan White form for later. Black coming up, I think he gave away the next form. I'm glad because blue just doesn't really look as cool as the past forms nor as good as white will, I think.[/QUOTE]
These forms are starting to sound like fan powerups. "THIS IS SUPER SAIYAN GOD, IT'S STRONGER THAN ALL THE SUPER SAIYANS AND IT TURNS GOKU'S HAIR RED. ORIGINAL MOVE DO NOT STEAL."

[Apollo the Just]

Maybe it's Future Mai's kid. I will be honest and state I never actually considered that possibility. That would make significantly more sense, considering the lack of dragon balls.

Or maybe she's main timeline Mai turned into a kid who then time traveled into his timeline. Because timeline shenanigans. Or maybe she's Mai from the past, Dragon Ball era, who wished on the dragon balls to time travel to the future. Maybe Future Trunks went to space and used the Namekian Dragon Balls to bring back the Dragon Balls on Earth and then Mai wished on those to become young. Who the **** knows. I just really hope there aren't gross cougar romances involved one way or another.

To be fair though, when I first met Future Trunks, at first I was like "literally who the **** is this ******* who just struck down frieza in one blow and is somehow a super saiyan,, what an OC" and then his backstory ended up being SO GOOD and he is my son now. So I have hope yet. There could be some cool **** coming our way.

not going to disagree with ur point abt Super Saiyan God, but to be fair that's kind of still how I feel about SSJ3. "remember how there was all that important foreshadowing from gohan's youth and that really emotional arc and how much pain and suffering it took to achieve the level beyond SSJ? and then Goku just punched stuff and now he has a LONG FLOWING MANE and is even stronger"

I feel like canon transformations and fanon transformations are basically indistinguishable at this point so I kind of just consume popcorn and enjoy the ridiculous buff dudes bein stronk

[I REALLY HATE POKEMON!]

[QUOTE="Valigarmander, post: 1598417, member: 30663"]Future!Mai looks awfully young, considering she's older than Bulma. Or did she get turned into a child in that timeline too? And if so... how? Piccolo was killed by the androids shortly after Trunks was born, so there are no Dragon Balls in that world to wish on.[DOUBLEPOST=1465593871,1465593805][/DOUBLEPOST]
These forms are starting to sound like fan powerups. "THIS IS SUPER SAIYAN GOD, IT'S STRONGER THAN ALL THE SUPER SAIYANS AND IT TURNS GOKU'S HAIR RED. ORIGINAL MOVE DO NOT STEAL."[/QUOTE]


I was wondering the same thing about Mai, seems to be a common question. Hopefully it is addressed. And yeah, the new forms all gave me that fanfic feeling as well, same for evil Goku actually. For some reason the idea of Super Saiyan White doesn't really bother me though, maybe because it isn't such an outlandish color as blue.

I think I'd normally be against a lazy "here's an evil version of the main good guy" but evil Goku makes sense in this instance since the story actually is that he was originally sent to Earth to destroy it, so I always sort of wondered how things would have progressed if he hadn't hit his head and became good. Probably something like Raditz minus the cowardice.

^ If it's Future Mai's kid that would be cool, but I'd wonder who the parents were. Maybe one of the Z Fighters so they can have an excuse to make her a competent warrior.

Speaking of SSj3, I was never the biggest fan of the form's appearance more than anything. For some reason more people seem to dislike SSj4 but it fits Goku pretty well IMO (Vegeta's design didn't really fit it well but then again SSj3 didn't fit him much either so maybe that's why Toriyama stuck him at SSj2 lol). The only redeeming value in SSjG is that it was very different from the normal SSj lines. The color, hair, and even body structure was a significant departure from what was expected.